Hi guys. Been thinking about doing this for a while. We need a place where we can discuss all things SprayMax 2K. I started using this product a few months back. It has goods and bads, and I'll be as brutally honest as possible and ask that others do the same in this space. No reason to be a fanboy for an auto-clear in a can. Just the facts and your honest opinions and experiences.

I've now used SprayMax on three playfields, including one in progress. Lots of pics at various stages.

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/curbfeelers-pinbot-restored
https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/curbfeelers-f14-tomcat-restoration-it-begins

*What Is SprayMax 2k*
SprayMax 2K is essentially nothing more than two-part automotive clearcoat (2PAC) in a can. By using a special can, they separate the clear from the catalyst hardener until you are ready to mix them. First you shake the can for 2 minutes. Then you press a button on the bottom to mix the clear and the catalyst. Then you shake for two more minutes. Then you spray. Those who know 2PAC would point out that there are different types (speeds) of hardeners and that mixing differently provides different experiences. They would also point out that once you have the mixed clear in the gun, that you adjust your gun accordingly. Well, SprayMax 2K doesn't have such adjustments. You get what you get.

*Why Use SprayMax 2K*
SprayMax 2K is not for everyone. When shooting pinbot, I listed out the pros and cons. Here they are.

PROS:
-Gives the finish you'd expect with auto clear. Colors are AMAZING!
-No mixing
-No possibility of contamination or dried glops in your clear.
-Nothing to clean up after spraying (less time in the booth no spraying laquer thinner into the air).
-Eliminates the need for the line filter, air compressor, a clean hose, guns, etc.
-Gives you an option to "demo" auto clear to decide if the toxic product is something you are even interested in using.

CONS:
-Costs more per ounce.
-Versus mixing your own, you may have to shift your schedule a bit based on the shelf life of the can. It's bricked after 48 hours, so you have to spray on consecutive days if you require two coats from a single can.
-You have no flexibility of "fast" or "medium" catalysts as you would with mixing.
-There is a learning curve to the spray pattern, and there is no adjustment as there is with a gun
-For lowered inserts you have to spray into a jar, then use a syringe to get it out, then apply it to the playfield. Not terribly convenient, and once you spray into the jar, you just started the 24 hour clock on the whole can.
-There is less support available and less "known" about using the product.

*Where Do I Get SprayMax 2K*
I get mine at Napa for $20 per can. They have a shelf of it and say they recommend it to all their amateur painters. I've also bought from http://www.repaintsupply.com/pd_2_part_2k_aerosol.cfm. for $25 shipped before I realized Napa carried it.

*How Do I Use SprayMax*
SprayMax 2K is just as toxic as the 2PAC that you shoot in a gun. No more, no less. If you don't want to die young (I'm not being dramatic here) then you need to take all the necessary precautions. You need to use a respirator approved for isocyanates. I also wear a bunny suit and swimming goggles and big shop goggles over those. Don't be an idiot, seriously.

I also created a cross-draft spray booth. For those who don't know what this is, it's a dedicated room with a furnace filter on air intake to ensure that only clean, dust-free air enters your space. there's a fan on exhaust and another air filter that ensures clearcoat particulate is captured so you don't poison your whole neighborhood.

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My First Coat

This is pinbot. I had absolutely no idea what I was doing, but I laid down a pretty thin coat. You can see two things here. You can see an eggshell pattern and the clear following the planking of the wood. The eggshell is just what SprayMax does when you spray it thin. It's like the droplets need other droplets to form a surrface tension with, and if they don't get that, they look like a million droplets combined. The planking is just the clear following the contours of what's there.

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First Coat Sanded

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Second Coat
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My Last Coat
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My F-14 Project is a work in progress, but things have not gone nearly as well. In fact, it's been a bit of a disaster, albeit one that in the end I know will be a success.

I think it's important to document failures as well as successes here. That way we know what to expect and what to avoid.

Whereas with my pinbot I put down a thin first coat on a warm day, My first coat with F14 was a different story. I was all suited up and ready to shoot when I realized that my spray room was on the cold side. The weather man had been telling us that it would be the last nice day, and the forecast was 60 by 2 pm. I watched the weather all day, hour by hour, and they were way off. It never got as warm as they said.

I mistakenly went for the "well, this could be my last chance to spray for a while; I better make it count" approach, which I realize now was the wrong approach. I laid the clear on pretty thick and essentially emptied the entire can. The result was that in a lot of spots it looked great but a lot of spots the clear didn't cover at all.

I should note that I did use Naptha, but I didn't apply a ton of force and really wipe it like crazy. So it's possible there was oil on the playfield in the spot that seems to have repelled the clear.

***FIRST COAT***
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So now I'm in disaster recovery mode. I sanded the mess pretty aggressively using a drywall sanding pad. By aggressively I mean I sanded into many of the inserts that were high, sanded off the raised spots under the posts, and basically tried to get as close to flat as possible without hitting the original coat. (sorry, didn't take pics after it was sanded).

I then put down yet another thick coat. At this point it was officially too cold to spray, but I put in two portable heaters and got it as close to 70 degrees as possible. Then I unplugged them, put a towel and a cardboard box over the heaters to prevent the still-glowing heating elements from starting a fire, and I sprayed. Afterward, I plugged them back in and shut off the fan. This time I used maybe 1/2 to 3/4 of the can. Here is one pic while still inside the paint room (wet) and a couple more the day after.

***SECOND COAT***
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This time thankfully I didn't have the issue where the clear didn't seem to want to stick to a specified area, but I had some bumpy areas even after previous sanding where the clear didn't flow down into and fill (sprayed clear doesn't do this, I've found).

One thing I might mention is that when I glued down my inserts I did get some on the playfield here and there. I cleaned this up with 91% alcohol and also cleaned my hands with it. Seemed to all come up, but also note most of the places where I had adherence probs are next to an insert.

So, what do I think caused this? Not sure, but I am leaning toward a combination of things. First, it was colder than it should have been. Second, maybe my prep wasn't top notch. Third, I was trying to spray too thick.

***SECOND COAT SANDED, CLEAR DROPPERED IN***
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Tezing - Glad to have you here. Let's figure this out. Do you think your problem is similar to these spots where the clear just didn't want to adhere?

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We both had great results on our first projects, then tried a second in too-low temps. What was your process when you filled the inserts? Were you using a syringe?

Okay, this is good info to know. I wouldn't be surprised to hear I'd failed to get it 100% clean. I would describe the wipedown I gave it with NAPTHA has kind of a gentle wipe, like you'd wipe a car you really loved with a soft diaper. Not the kind of thing that was going to remove oils, greases, waxes, adhesives, etc. I mixed the epoxy with a match and then used that to set my inserts, so it's possible maybe some un-mixed and un-set epoxy could have formed a thin layer and repelled the adhesive as well. These are things I've thought of in the days following my bad coat. That would certainly explain the large area at the top of my pf where the clear just wants nothing to do with the playfield at all.

However, there does appear to be something else going on with the plastic inserts. Let me ask you this, tezing, on my pinbot I didn't sand my inserts down to bare plastic -- I just left the old, cracked clearcoat on there. I didn't want to open a can or worms I didn't have the skills to address.

On F-14 I got some confidence and decided to pull and sand every insert. So this is the first time I see the clear directly on the plastic of the insert. Maybe a chemical reaction? What about you -- did you clear on the existing finish or directly on sanded, bare plastic inserts?

Yes, don't worry that it won't be great. It will be. You will just end up wasting more cans of clear than you wanted and doing way more sanding than you expected. My F14 was a disaster at the first coat, and I still need to post the pics of my most recent coat, but it's looking great -- one more light sand and ready to paint the keylines. It's not that it won't be perfect in the end, just a lot more work than you wanted.

I'm considering not re-clearing until Spring. That's a long time for a game to sit, but what can you do? It's crazy cold out there.

dan

Thanks for your input. Totally agree with you that this is the best way to get professional looking results, bar none. I've personally gone the Spraymax 2K route for probably the same reason most other guys have. I only do 1-2 playfields per year, I wasn't sure if auto clear would be for me, etc. I am now re-thinking that, for what it's worth, but still feel it's valuable to have a space like this to discuss the SprayMax option.

I know this is off topic, but in some of your initial tests with auto clears many moons ago you had good results using a foam brush. I've had great results painting cabinets using a foam roller and have given thought more than once to trying this in thin coats to clear a playfield. I know it would require sanding between coats, but it would eliminate the scariest part of the process for me which is all that toxic overspray. I'm just curious, have you moved on from the foam brush and do you now spray only? Do you think if a guy used a foam roller and had a s__t-ton of patience that he could get a professional result?

Dan

Those results on your Paragon are great! Nice job on that.

Wow, Spring Break really came out nice! That's impressive work.

Colors really pop on that Cheetah. Picture is a bit too grainy to see the finish you ended up with, though. How many coats did you do? When you say it was just okay, do you mean it looked kind of egg-shelly? I have found that your lighter coats will be eggshell, then you have to sand the tops off, then more egg shell, then sand the tops off, etc. Finally if you spray a thick final coat you will get the more show-room finish.

My 1st bad coat (when the clear kind of repelled from a couple areas on the playfield and inserts) was from one can, but I don't think there was anything wrong with that can. I think it had to be a combination of temp, prep, and a too-thick first coat.

? Not sure what you mean. I put the red plastic thingy on the bottom of the can, push it on the ground, then shake it two minutes. I generally press this trigger several times to make sure the catalyst got into the clear.

In the case of my first bad coat, I think prep was an issue. As for the tiny pinpricks I have on my playfield from my third coat, I just think this is temperature-related. Playfield/current clear is one temp, air is another, clear in the can is yet another, then after clearing I heat the spray room, which is another. I think this raises very tiny solvent pops. Just a theory, but I think it's unrelated to the other issue.

I do, then I shake some more after two passes, then some more as I spray the rest out.

Oh yikes! It melted your overlay? That must have been so depressing. Kudos to you that you didn't drive the machine over a cliff but hung in there and re-did it. Looks great now.

Don't suppose you have a pic handy? would be interested to see what that looks like.

Well, I was following

Okay, I should have mentioned this earlier. Aside from trying SprayMax 2K for my clearcoat, I am following all of Vid1900's methods here...

https://pinside.com/pinball/forum/topic/vids-guide-to-ultimate-playfield-restoration

Vid goes into a great amount of detail regarding how to do each step, and he also details steps for how to spray with automotive clearcoat the "correct" way which is to use a compressor and guns. I'm doing everything he recommends except substituting SprayMax for the auto clear.

What you detail above is correct for my pinbot. I sanded with 800 to 1000 between coats. My second coat I actually sprayed it medium-thick and sanded that pretty flat before the third coat. The third coat was my thickest coat and looked perfect.

Ok, first of all, your English is pretty amazing. Thanks for sharing the story and the pics. I'll view them from home tonight. The google plus stuff is blocked from here.

Dan

Funny, I can't decide if I'm glad I found the stuff of sorry. Depends on the hour, I guess. I'm probably going to end up going the full HVLP setup at some point in the not so distant future. SprayMax does have pros in the pro column, certainly, but you end up losing the ability to tweak several things (spray pattern, flow, fish eye, mixture, etc.).

Dan