(Topic ID: 330989)

Locating short circuits

By Incomer

1 year ago



Topic Stats

  • 9 posts
  • 5 Pinsiders participating
  • Latest reply 1 year ago by Incomer
  • Topic is favorited by 1 Pinsider

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Heat Wave schematic Extract (resized).jpg
#1 1 year ago

Hi everyone
What is the best way to track down short circuits please?

I have two games with shorts at the moment, a 1964 Wms heat wave that I've owned for 40 years with no problems but has suddenly developed a short on the lighting circuit (all playfield bulbs are dim and the lighting fuse burns up slowly ), and a 1969 Wms post time where plugging in the playfield pops the 24v fuse

Is there a logical way of approaching this?

Thanks as always for your comments
David

#2 1 year ago

Hi David,

I usually try to isolate things. For the Heat Wave, If you're talking about the GI lighting, I'd try and unplug the back box connector that carries the lighting power and return. See if the playfield lights go back to their correct brilliance. Or vice versa, disconnect playfield lighting and see if the back box lighting works. That could help isolate where the short is. Did this problem occur after some other work done? Retrace your steps from that job and maybe find the short. It's pretty easy to bend something and create the short. I know reaching around inside my machines my sleeve gets caught on things and could potentially cause problems. I've created more problems trying to fix other problems. Good luck

#3 1 year ago

Divide your problem into parts.

A frequent problem is a string of General Illumination lights that causes the fuse to blow (in your case, be using too much power).

I'm not familiar with EM's as much as I am with more modern pinballs, but each string connects to a connector, right?

So, I have my diagonal cutters, and my soldering iron, I have a circuit breaker that is soldered to a blown fuse. If the General Illumination is normally a 5 amp fuse, my circuit breaker will be a 4-amp... it won't blow unless there is a problem, but it'll blow quicker when I'm testing. Alternately you could use a couple boxes of fuses to do the same troubleshooting.

The trick is to cut out a section, and see if the problem still is there.

So if the General Illumination has plugs for the backboard, and the playfield, I'll disconnect the backboard, and turn on the machine... do I still have a problem? If I'm now not blowing the fuse (dimming the lights) on the playfield, I know my problem is on the backboard.

So now I connect the backboard and disconnect the playfield. Turn the machine on, do I blow the fuse (dim the lights)? This confirms the section is somewhere in the backbox lighting.

Now I use my wire cutters. The idea is to make your cut where you can easily take some solder and bridge your cut with solder to reconnect.

I try to find a halfway point. Suppose I have two strings, of eight lights each. I'll make my cut to take out one of the two strings, turn on the machine, do I still have the problem? That isolates it to one string.

That string has eight lights. Find the middle point. Cut there. Do I still have the problem? I know it's one of the four remaining lights in the circuit. Or, I don't find the problem there, I use some solder to bridge the cut I made, and reconnect the other four lights, but now I cut halfway between the ones I know the problem is in.

Divide the problem by two when possible, have some way to identify where the problem is (easy if it blows fuses!), be ready to solder things back together as you complete each stage.

It's tedious, but this is how you do it.

#4 1 year ago
Quoted from PinRetail:

Divide your problem into parts.
A frequent problem is a string of General Illumination lights that causes the fuse to blow (in your case, be using too much power).
I'm not familiar with EM's as much as I am with more modern pinballs, but each string connects to a connector, right?
So, I have my diagonal cutters, and my soldering iron, I have a circuit breaker that is soldered to a blown fuse. If the General Illumination is normally a 5 amp fuse, my circuit breaker will be a 4-amp... it won't blow unless there is a problem, but it'll blow quicker when I'm testing. Alternately you could use a couple boxes of fuses to do the same troubleshooting.
The trick is to cut out a section, and see if the problem still is there.
So if the General Illumination has plugs for the backboard, and the playfield, I'll disconnect the backboard, and turn on the machine... do I still have a problem? If I'm now not blowing the fuse (dimming the lights) on the playfield, I know my problem is on the backboard.
So now I connect the backboard and disconnect the playfield. Turn the machine on, do I blow the fuse (dim the lights)? This confirms the section is somewhere in the backbox lighting.
Now I use my wire cutters. The idea is to make your cut where you can easily take some solder and bridge your cut with solder to reconnect.
I try to find a halfway point. Suppose I have two strings, of eight lights each. I'll make my cut to take out one of the two strings, turn on the machine, do I still have the problem? That isolates it to one string.
That string has eight lights. Find the middle point. Cut there. Do I still have the problem? I know it's one of the four remaining lights in the circuit. Or, I don't find the problem there, I use some solder to bridge the cut I made, and reconnect the other four lights, but now I cut halfway between the ones I know the problem is in.
Divide the problem by two when possible, have some way to identify where the problem is (easy if it blows fuses!), be ready to solder things back together as you complete each stage.
It's tedious, but this is how you do it.

Yea, divide and concur. I first do a visual inspection and since its a slow burn you can feel along looking for the hot spot? (Maybe its all hot). So after 10 minutes of looking at socket tabs etc I start desoldering pieces.

i have a service call today with a Bank-a-ball blowing the lightbox lighting fuse quickly... Im betting that the exposed wires of the score reel lighting is the culprit. I also have a 15 amp mini circuit I'll substitute for the cartridge fuse.

#5 1 year ago

With the general illumination shorts, usually a shorted lamp socket can be pinpointed by the brightness. Lamps near the short are dimmer than those further away. And if all playfield GI is equally dim, then the short is probably not on playfield.

#6 1 year ago

Thank you all for your comments - I'll try and have a go this weekend.

TinkerV2 - no other work has been done on the game recently - I was just in the middle of a game and all the playfield lights went dim (but not those in the backbox which are separately fused and hence presumably an entirely separate string)

#7 1 year ago

Incomer, So if the backbox lights are at full brilliance and only the playfield lights went dim, I don't think you have a short. All the lights use the same 6vac tap on the transformer. If there was a short, all the lights in the machine would be dim. I'm inclined to believe you have a contact problem with the connector that supplies the 6vac and common to the playfield. If those pins are dirty or corroded they add excessive resistance to the circuit. That resistance can drop voltage to the lights causing them to dim. It can also heat up the connection which could cause the fuse to blow. If there is a separate fuse for the playfield lights, I'd check the fuse holder for corrosion too. Like 'pinretail' mentioned and I've done the same, I soldered a circuit breaker to a blown fuse. Inserted this circuit breaker assembly into that fuse holder. Now the breaker will trip instead of blowing a bunch of fuses. When the problem is fixed, then put in a good fuse. Report back with your findings. Good luck.

#8 1 year ago

I've managed to spend some time on the game tonight and thought I was making progress but now I'm more confused than ever

I noticed that the lamps were all bright when I started a game, but when the relay bank reset the lights would go dim.

I worked my way through the relays on the bank and found that it is the tilt relay that is the culprit
When this is reset, ie normal game mode, the lights are dim
If I manually trip it (ie put it into tilt) all the lights are bright!
The backbox lamps do dim with the playfield ones, but not to the extent of the playfield ones
I identified the actual pair of contacts which were causing the effect which I think are those shown in column 5 in the attached schematic extract
If the tilt relay is tripped and the lamps are bright, tripping the game over relay dims the lights
So the problem looks to be in the lamps to the right of column 5

This where it gets confusing.
I started to divide and conquer as suggested by snipping at points in the common return (bare wire) to take out sections and see if the problem remained.
I ended up with a situation where lamps where I had removed them from completely from the common return still glowed dimly!
How can this be happening?

I'm hoping you can see this in the video:


- I am manually making and releasing the break in the common return
When the circuit is made one lamp glows normally
When the circuit is broken the three linked lamps all glow dimly even though there is no return circuit

I'm totally puzzled by this, especially as the game had been played normally by many people and then it suddenly went like this half way through a game I was playing

Anyone any ideas where I should go next please?

Many thanks for all your input
David

Heat Wave schematic Extract (resized).jpgHeat Wave schematic Extract (resized).jpg
#9 1 year ago

OK I found it

I was getting nowhere with the playfield in place so I took it out and examined the underside for anything obvious

Then I got an old PC power supply and used the 5v output through a 5A circuit breaker to power each lamp in turn

Most lit OK but one immediately blew the circuit breaker

I replaced the lamp socket and now my short circuit has gone

In hindsight that was an easier and neater approach than all the cutting and resoldering, so I would probably come at it that way if I get a similar problem in the future.

I still don't know why all the lamps glow dimly when the common is cut but they are all OK when the common is complete , but with the common complete it all works OK so that's the main thing

Thanks for your input - hope my solution might help you and others too

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